Betting Talk

How to Make Plays with Really Big Juice?

TommyLTommyL Super Moderator
edited October 2012 in Sports Betting
What would you do with the following scenario...England plays San Marino today in soccer, and was -10000 on the money line. Based on the numbers that I ran, I give England a 99.8% chance of winning the game (and trust those numbers and really think that they are a bit of an underlay). I thought that eating the -10000 juice is a +EV play in this situation, and did make a play on it. However, trying to figure out what to put on it was a challenge. What is the optimal way to play something like this?

Suppose that my standard play is 1% of bankroll. It didn't really make sense to play 1 unit to win .01 units. At the same time, something like 50 units to win .5 units obviously seems way too aggressive. For those that are willing to play an enormous favorite if you find it to be +EV, how do you handle it? I'd be interested to hear thoughts on the following topic from some of the more serious posters on the site (no offense to anyone, but I don't really want the "it's dumb to play a favorite that big", since there certainly are spots where it should be an option).

Comments

  • GoatsGoats Head Moderator
    edited October 2012
    http://www.sbrforum.com/betting-tools/kelly-calculator/

    Proper full Kelly bet size is 79.8% of your BR. :)
  • RonbetsRonbets Senior Member
    edited October 2012
    I play anything that has a positive ROI. In your case, standard play 1% of BR with the full trust of your #s.
  • TommyLTommyL Super Moderator
    edited October 2012
    Ronbets wrote: »
    I play anything that has a positive ROI. In your case, standard play 1% of BR with the full trust of your #s.

    If I was playing to win 1%, it would be a 100% play. If I'm playing to lay 1%, I'd win .01. I assume the optimal play is something in between those.
  • underwrapsunderwraps Senior Member
    edited October 2012
    thank God they busted that guy in Singapore
  • Obi OneObi One Senior Member
    edited October 2012
    There's another -10000 fave on the board. NETH vs AND. If your numbers give you the same +EV on that bet too, why not parlay the 2?
  • TommyLTommyL Super Moderator
    edited October 2012
    Goats wrote: »
    http://www.sbrforum.com/betting-tools/kelly-calculator/

    Proper full Kelly bet size is 79.8% of your BR. :)

    Great. I actually didn't even try it since I knew it would spit out something ridiculous (that is if you consider 80% of bankroll ridiculous). :)
  • TommyLTommyL Super Moderator
    edited October 2012
    Obi One wrote: »
    There's another -10000 fave on the board. NETH vs AND. If your numbers give you the same +EV on that bet too, why not parlay the 2?
    I had that game as pretty much spot on.

    And also, it's a little moot now since England jumped to -15000 after I played it. Plus I was looking at this from more of a philosophical standpoint since I already made my play on it.
  • underwrapsunderwraps Senior Member
    edited October 2012
    No offense, but I wouldn't lay 10,000 -1 even if I knew the game was finished already
  • TommyLTommyL Super Moderator
    edited October 2012
    underwraps wrote: »
    No offense, but I wouldn't lay 10,000 -1 even if I knew the game was finished already

    -10000 is 100-1, not 10000-1.
  • underwrapsunderwraps Senior Member
    edited October 2012
    ahh ok my bad
  • RonbetsRonbets Senior Member
    edited October 2012
    1% of the lay.
  • GoatsGoats Head Moderator
    edited October 2012
    TommyL wrote: »
    Great. I actually didn't even try it since I knew it would spit out something ridiculous (that is if you consider 80% of bankroll ridiculous). :)

    Well, since full Kelly is generally seen as way too aggressive for pros, using something more realistic like 1/4 Kelly would only have you betting ~20% of your BR. Is that still ridiculous?

    Something else to think about, and perhaps a better reason one might want to just skip a bet like this. For every 1/10 of a % you overestimate the win rate at, the proper bet amount drops drastically. And of course if it's somehow only a 99.0% play, the proper bet amount is zero.

    Good academic exercise. Now if only there were a calculator to help my solve my dinner/wife issue for tonight. :)
  • lumpy19lumpy19 Senior Member
    edited October 2012
    I treat it similar to any other bet. My bigger concern is how much of my bankroll it ties up and for how long. This time of year I just can't afford to bet favorites like that. During the summer months I regularly bet lines similar to that in Tennis. I lost 8k on some stupid favorite this summer, that was fun. The losses definitely stick out more than the wins.

    On occasion I look to parlay with any other match that has an edge to reduce my risk.
  • RonbetsRonbets Senior Member
    edited October 2012
    Lumpy that musta been Roddick?
  • travisbickletravisbickle Senior Member
    edited October 2012
    I had a friend who lost mid six figures on a legit company MF Global. I could not imagine having the balance at some off site book to make any meaningful return on -10000. The bet would not scare me, laying my money there would every day.
  • lumpy19lumpy19 Senior Member
    edited October 2012
    Ronbets wrote: »
    Lumpy that musta been Roddick?

    No I missed that bomb, it was a nothing match in the middle of summer. Lost the acct I bet it at....I'll see if I can find it, was 8k to win $500, think he lost 7-6, 7-6....nothing like -8k before 10am.

    I may not be betting them properly but I just treat it like any other wager.

    Edited: found the ticket
    MU
    STRAIGHT BET
    [4032] T BERDYCH -1600
    (E GULBIS vrs T BERDYCH)

    8000 / 500

    -8000
    LOSE
    LOSE
    06/25/2012 11:18 AM
  • RonbetsRonbets Senior Member
    edited October 2012
    Yikes! To Gulbis no less. That Czech is currently rolling in China. Just buried Tsonga.

    edit. Sorry Tommy don't wanna hijack ur thread. I'm out.
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