Sy , Cespedes was the one scare in the lineup the A's had, now that is gone. They didn't need Lester they needed a middle infielder that could hit. "Cuban" hitter , yeah can't walk off the island. MLB is about to be flooded with them.
Dunn another 200 hitter that has come out and said his career is done in 30 days, why bother ?
If MLB is to be flooded with them, pitchers will have a field day. 95% of them are 1 trick ponies that can't adjust. He comes in and has a great rookie year, teams get a book on him and he accepts his .250-.260 avg with some power. He makes no adjustment. He is what he is, a "good" hitter. Maybe fans fear him because the media makes him out to be a star, but I doubt many pitchers do. They respect him like they do any other solid but not spectacular hitter with power. The difference between a hitter like him and someone like Brandon Moss is you don't have to throw a strike to get him out. At least with Moss, he will make you pay for not throwing strikes. With Cespedes, get ahead with a strike or by bouncing a changeup, then don't come back into the zone. He gets himself out more than the average hitter. Trust me, those guys are not feared.
As bad as you make Dunn out to be, on a bad year he will get on base more than a good year for Cespedes. I know people don't care about a power hitter walking, but you just added a guy that has an on base average equal to your lead off hitter. As much as he strikes out, he still walks a ton. With all his walks, and being a power hitter, I don't care about his strikeouts. What is a power hitter going to do more often than not if he makes contact on one of his strikeout AB's? Pop up/fly out. What's the difference between a pop up and a strikeout in the majors? Not much unless there is a guy on 3rd and less than 2 out. He would increase his average a little if he "tried" not to K(although he said he tried that once and it made things worse), but his power would decline too and you lose the reason you have him. Yeah he isnt the player he was 6 years ago when he was hitting .260 with the power and all the walks, but he does as much or more with his non-out at bats than Cespedes does. I'd take a big left handed power hitter who has done well vs righties even this year(only 1 year in his career has he had an OPS under .800 vs righties), with power to make any stadium small, that walks a ton, as my DH. The only issue is now the A's have what 3 or 4 guys who rake righties and can't hit lefties(Vogt, Jaso, Dunn off the top of my head). Price is the only lefty starter they need to worry about in the playoffs(just stand there and CJ Wilson will walk you), so loading up with these type hitters is not a bad thing as long as you have some righties you trust on the bench for late game moves. People like to rip on Dunn but I bet you 90% of the right handed pitchers out there will tell you they worry about him coming up than most any other hitter on the A's right now. K's or no K's, pitchers hate facing guys with power that rarely leave the strike zone.
Quite interesting contradiction.
So Dunns strike outs are ok and horrible defense when he is forced to play, but Cespedes is. 1 trick pony.
Ok I think I know where you are coming from. Enuf said
Guess the Red Sox shud have called you before wAsting all that money on a 2nd , one trick pony that they won a bidding war on.
Quite interesting contradiction.
So Dunns strike outs are ok and horrible defense when he is forced to play, but Cespedes is. 1 trick pony.
Ok I think I know where you are coming from. Enuf said
Guess the Red Sox shud have called you before wAsting all that money on a 2nd , one trick pony that they won a bidding war on.
Smh
1st off, Dunn is not playing defense in Oakland. 2nd, 1 trick pony meaning he has never adjusted to what pitchers are doing to him. Get ahead 0-1, don't throw another pitch over the plate, he's back in the dugout. Get ahead of Dunn 0-1, don't throw another strike, Dunn will be on 1st. Cespedes strikes out a lot too, not as much as Dunn, and I don't care about his K's either but do you know that Dunn makes less outs than Cespedes and does as much or more with his non-outs as Cespedes? Dunn gets on base as much as Moss, Crisp, etc. A .340 on base Avg with power. Fuck the BA. I seriously don't understand how adding a guy with a .800+ OPS(they didn't get him to face lefties) to a lineup with only 2 other players over .800(and 1 of those guys will be dropping under soon) is a bad move after the trade deadline. There is no risk to this move, only upside and they need something because they look lost. If they don't wake up this series, they will have to start worrying about their playoff spot instead of the division.
They left out the fact that he once stole 19 bases in a season. That's probably the biggest jaw dropper for most, or that he had a football scholarship to play QB at Texas. He is the poster child for the word unique. Above all he was always a good guy and never pussied out of any responsibility.
Lot to be said about team Chemistry. Statistics don't justify everything.
Could have done without the Lester - Gomes trade. Horrible trade imo -
Yeah, chemistry is good. I just don't see Cespedes as a "chemistry" guy. I bet if you asked every A's player who do they like better as a teammate, Dunn or Cespedes, 95%+ would say Dunn. Cespedes gone hasn't made everyone stop hitting. There is a ongoing 100 yr myth about having a guy to "protect" you hitting behind you. It's total shit. If Miguel Cabrera is hitting behind me, I'm not going to see more fastballs. What I will see is pitchers coming over the heart of the plate more when they get behind me 2-0/3-1. Nothing more. They won't pitch me different. Now if I have Mike Trout/Jose Altuve hitting in front of me and they get on base, I will see more fastballs(except if I am Albert Pujols who doesnt like guys running while he is hitting and teams figure out that Trout doesn't run much while Pujols is up). I doubt all the A's hitters who have fallen off a cliff have done so because Cespedes is gone. Looks like they are back to their career norms.
Hey I agree with some of what you were saying. Cespedes was a liked guy in the locker room though but I think you are right in a few weeks guys are raving about Dunn as well.
But since I got you here - I know it won't happen but I really believe there is an argument for Altuve for MVP. He has had one fabulous year both offense and defense. Probably not a fair comparison but hey If they can give it to Andre Dawson for a last place Cubs team why can't Altuve get it.
Hey I agree with some of what you were saying. Cespedes was a liked guy in the locker room though but I think you are right in a few weeks guys are raving about Dunn as well.
But since I got you here - I know it won't happen but I really believe there is an argument for Altuve for MVP. He has had one fabulous year both offense and defense. Probably not a fair comparison but hey If they can give it to Andre Dawson for a last place Cubs team why can't Altuve get it.
Hey I agree with some of what you were saying. Cespedes was a liked guy in the locker room though but I think you are right in a few weeks guys are raving about Dunn as well.
But since I got you here - I know it won't happen but I really believe there is an argument for Altuve for MVP. He has had one fabulous year both offense and defense. Probably not a fair comparison but hey If they can give it to Andre Dawson for a last place Cubs team why can't Altuve get it.
Thoughts ?
Altuve? I love that little fucker. When he came into the league, people were saying he is what he is, too small, limited upside, little power, empty avg, etc, etc. What did he do? He improved what he could. He can't grow 8 inches, but he can put some muscle on, which he did, without losing his speed. His height already makes him hard to pitch to, teams are scared to walk him because he will turn it into a double, but he will also wind up the year with 55+ extra base hits. You don't want to walk him yet you can't just say "here hit it" anymore either. As far as MVP, I'm more of an emphasizing the "V" person, valuable. I've always been neutral on whether you can really be valuable by making a worse team "less bad"(like Dawson). I have no problem with it unless there is someone comparable or better on a good team. I don't like throwing your team result into player awards but for this award, that's what I think "valuable" means. Your team needed you. CY Young award states best pitcher in the league, not most valuable, so team result should have no bearing. If it was MOP(most outstanding player), without a doubt he should be up there, maybe not winning it but among those mentioned. That's how some people vote for the MVP so if he should wind up winning it or get a lot of votes, I got no problem with it. No one can downplay the season he has had or the player he had made himself. There is no criteria on how you interpret the "V".
He's worrying me right now to be honest. His swing is getting longer and longer as the season goes on. Is he a little tired or he is just swinging out of his ass? If it is the latter, he needs to stop.
He's worrying me right now to be honest. His swing is getting longer and longer as the season goes on. Is he a little tired or he is just swinging out of his ass? If it is the latter, he needs to stop.
Yeh he has started every single game for 3 months. Tonight off should help give him 2 nights off hopefully.
Yeah Worm, I think Trout is a runaway for the MVP. No ?
Never been a fan of Pitchers winning MVP ever. But looks like Kershaw is getting that , maybe cuz I see him a lot but Hunter Pence is pretty amazing and valuable to the Giants I think.
Yeah Worm, I think Trout is a runaway for the MVP. No ?
Never been a fan of Pitchers winning MVP ever. But looks like Kershaw is getting that , maybe cuz I see him a lot but Hunter Pence is pretty amazing and valuable to the Giants I think.
Yes trout will win. Would think altuve prolly in the 7-10 range?
Yeah Worm, I think Trout is a runaway for the MVP. No ?
Never been a fan of Pitchers winning MVP ever. But looks like Kershaw is getting that , maybe cuz I see him a lot but Hunter Pence is pretty amazing and valuable to the Giants I think.
Hunter Pence? Kershaw probably wins the MVP, but if not then it's got to be Giancarlo Stanton
Comments
His career .768 OPS vs RHP didn't scare anybody.
And as I've discussed, Gomes is essentially the same guy vs. LHP.
If MLB is to be flooded with them, pitchers will have a field day. 95% of them are 1 trick ponies that can't adjust. He comes in and has a great rookie year, teams get a book on him and he accepts his .250-.260 avg with some power. He makes no adjustment. He is what he is, a "good" hitter. Maybe fans fear him because the media makes him out to be a star, but I doubt many pitchers do. They respect him like they do any other solid but not spectacular hitter with power. The difference between a hitter like him and someone like Brandon Moss is you don't have to throw a strike to get him out. At least with Moss, he will make you pay for not throwing strikes. With Cespedes, get ahead with a strike or by bouncing a changeup, then don't come back into the zone. He gets himself out more than the average hitter. Trust me, those guys are not feared.
As bad as you make Dunn out to be, on a bad year he will get on base more than a good year for Cespedes. I know people don't care about a power hitter walking, but you just added a guy that has an on base average equal to your lead off hitter. As much as he strikes out, he still walks a ton. With all his walks, and being a power hitter, I don't care about his strikeouts. What is a power hitter going to do more often than not if he makes contact on one of his strikeout AB's? Pop up/fly out. What's the difference between a pop up and a strikeout in the majors? Not much unless there is a guy on 3rd and less than 2 out. He would increase his average a little if he "tried" not to K(although he said he tried that once and it made things worse), but his power would decline too and you lose the reason you have him. Yeah he isnt the player he was 6 years ago when he was hitting .260 with the power and all the walks, but he does as much or more with his non-out at bats than Cespedes does. I'd take a big left handed power hitter who has done well vs righties even this year(only 1 year in his career has he had an OPS under .800 vs righties), with power to make any stadium small, that walks a ton, as my DH. The only issue is now the A's have what 3 or 4 guys who rake righties and can't hit lefties(Vogt, Jaso, Dunn off the top of my head). Price is the only lefty starter they need to worry about in the playoffs(just stand there and CJ Wilson will walk you), so loading up with these type hitters is not a bad thing as long as you have some righties you trust on the bench for late game moves. People like to rip on Dunn but I bet you 90% of the right handed pitchers out there will tell you they worry about him coming up than most any other hitter on the A's right now. K's or no K's, pitchers hate facing guys with power that rarely leave the strike zone.
So Dunns strike outs are ok and horrible defense when he is forced to play, but Cespedes is. 1 trick pony.
Ok I think I know where you are coming from. Enuf said
Guess the Red Sox shud have called you before wAsting all that money on a 2nd , one trick pony that they won a bidding war on.
Smh
1st off, Dunn is not playing defense in Oakland. 2nd, 1 trick pony meaning he has never adjusted to what pitchers are doing to him. Get ahead 0-1, don't throw another pitch over the plate, he's back in the dugout. Get ahead of Dunn 0-1, don't throw another strike, Dunn will be on 1st. Cespedes strikes out a lot too, not as much as Dunn, and I don't care about his K's either but do you know that Dunn makes less outs than Cespedes and does as much or more with his non-outs as Cespedes? Dunn gets on base as much as Moss, Crisp, etc. A .340 on base Avg with power. Fuck the BA. I seriously don't understand how adding a guy with a .800+ OPS(they didn't get him to face lefties) to a lineup with only 2 other players over .800(and 1 of those guys will be dropping under soon) is a bad move after the trade deadline. There is no risk to this move, only upside and they need something because they look lost. If they don't wake up this series, they will have to start worrying about their playoff spot instead of the division.
This this this so much this.
Lol was wondering how long this was going to take to post.
2-2 he may never make an out ever again.
So many things. Dunn. Buchholz. Stay tuned on the rest.
Thanks for the stats of wisdom.
Last 2 starts were ok.
But I just don't see it.
Cespedes in Boston .302 OBP, .749 OPS
Since the Dunn trade
Cespedes .313 OBP, .735 OPS
Dunn .393 OBP, .935 OPS.
Just brought it up because ESPN actually posted a decent article for a change, about the "unique" career of Adam Dunn.
http://espn.go.com/blog/jayson-stark/post/_/id/899/adam-dunns-one-of-a-kind-career
They left out the fact that he once stole 19 bases in a season. That's probably the biggest jaw dropper for most, or that he had a football scholarship to play QB at Texas. He is the poster child for the word unique. Above all he was always a good guy and never pussied out of any responsibility.
17-27 (4th worst in all of MLB since 8/1)
2 game lead in AL West - Gone
AL West Division - Gone
Lot to be said about team Chemistry. Statistics don't justify everything.
Could have done without the Lester - Gomes trade. Horrible trade imo -
Yeah, chemistry is good. I just don't see Cespedes as a "chemistry" guy. I bet if you asked every A's player who do they like better as a teammate, Dunn or Cespedes, 95%+ would say Dunn. Cespedes gone hasn't made everyone stop hitting. There is a ongoing 100 yr myth about having a guy to "protect" you hitting behind you. It's total shit. If Miguel Cabrera is hitting behind me, I'm not going to see more fastballs. What I will see is pitchers coming over the heart of the plate more when they get behind me 2-0/3-1. Nothing more. They won't pitch me different. Now if I have Mike Trout/Jose Altuve hitting in front of me and they get on base, I will see more fastballs(except if I am Albert Pujols who doesnt like guys running while he is hitting and teams figure out that Trout doesn't run much while Pujols is up). I doubt all the A's hitters who have fallen off a cliff have done so because Cespedes is gone. Looks like they are back to their career norms.
But since I got you here - I know it won't happen but I really believe there is an argument for Altuve for MVP. He has had one fabulous year both offense and defense. Probably not a fair comparison but hey If they can give it to Andre Dawson for a last place Cubs team why can't Altuve get it.
Thoughts ?
Cuz he plays in the same league as michael trout?
Altuve? I love that little fucker. When he came into the league, people were saying he is what he is, too small, limited upside, little power, empty avg, etc, etc. What did he do? He improved what he could. He can't grow 8 inches, but he can put some muscle on, which he did, without losing his speed. His height already makes him hard to pitch to, teams are scared to walk him because he will turn it into a double, but he will also wind up the year with 55+ extra base hits. You don't want to walk him yet you can't just say "here hit it" anymore either. As far as MVP, I'm more of an emphasizing the "V" person, valuable. I've always been neutral on whether you can really be valuable by making a worse team "less bad"(like Dawson). I have no problem with it unless there is someone comparable or better on a good team. I don't like throwing your team result into player awards but for this award, that's what I think "valuable" means. Your team needed you. CY Young award states best pitcher in the league, not most valuable, so team result should have no bearing. If it was MOP(most outstanding player), without a doubt he should be up there, maybe not winning it but among those mentioned. That's how some people vote for the MVP so if he should wind up winning it or get a lot of votes, I got no problem with it. No one can downplay the season he has had or the player he had made himself. There is no criteria on how you interpret the "V".
He's worrying me right now to be honest. His swing is getting longer and longer as the season goes on. Is he a little tired or he is just swinging out of his ass? If it is the latter, he needs to stop.
Yeh he has started every single game for 3 months. Tonight off should help give him 2 nights off hopefully.
Yeah Worm, I think Trout is a runaway for the MVP. No ?
Never been a fan of Pitchers winning MVP ever. But looks like Kershaw is getting that , maybe cuz I see him a lot but Hunter Pence is pretty amazing and valuable to the Giants I think.
Yes trout will win. Would think altuve prolly in the 7-10 range?
Hunter Pence? Kershaw probably wins the MVP, but if not then it's got to be Giancarlo Stanton